monitor 60hz after fresh installation 60hz old bug aga

After a fresh installation Windows Vista desktop runs at 60Hz. The monitor refresh rate is not automatically adjusted to 75Hz, why we still have this old bug? It's old because we have the same bug in Windows XP SP2, but for the full screen DirectX applications (and also previous versions) that run at 60Hz. Any chances to fix this bug in 2007?

This isn't a bug as AFAIK. It is set up that way because TFT monitors usually need to be set at 60. Is Windows supposed to read your mind and set it to your liking? You wouldnt be too happy if you had an LCD monitor and couldnt get a display after install because the refresh rate was auto set at 75.

"BillD" wrote in message

After a fresh installation Windows Vista desktop runs at 60Hz. The monitor refresh rate is not automatically adjusted to 75Hz, why we still have this old bug? It's old because we have the same bug in Windows XP SP2, but for the full screen DirectX applications (and also previous versions) that run at 60Hz. Any chances to fix this bug in 2007?

"Bones" wrote:

This isn't a bug as AFAIK. It is set up that way because TFT monitors usually need to be set at 60. Is Windows supposed to read your mind and set it to your liking? You wouldnt be too happy if you had an LCD monitor and couldnt get a display after install because the refresh rate was auto set at 75.

I don't agree with you because also my very old CRT monitor has the refresh rate coded into the hardware and readable, so Windows should be able to read and set a resolution at lest of 75Hz if supported. If Windows is able to enumerate my monitor refresh rate without to need a drivers, I don't understand why Windows Vista should set the refresh rate a 60Hz whan my monitor support also the 75Hz. I don't like linux, but this winter I tried Utuntu linux and my monitor has been detected correctly and set automatically at 85Hz and also many years ago I tried Mandrake linux and my monitor refresh rate detected correctly. So I don't understand why Windows is not able to do this?

On Tue, 13 Jun 2006 06:39:02 -0700, BillD wrote:

"Bones" wrote: This isn't a bug as AFAIK. It is set up that way because TFT monitors usually need to be set at 60. Is Windows supposed to read your mind and set it to your liking? You wouldnt be too happy if you had an LCD monitor and couldnt get a display after install because the refresh rate was auto set at 75.
I don't agree with you because also my very old CRT monitor has the refresh rate coded into the hardware and readable, so Windows should be able to read and set a resolution at lest of 75Hz if supported. If Windows is able to enumerate my monitor refresh rate without to need a drivers, I don't understand why Windows Vista should set the refresh rate a 60Hz whan my monitor support also the 75Hz. I don't like linux, but this winter I tried Utuntu linux and my monitor has been detected correctly and set automatically at 85Hz and also many years ago I tried Mandrake linux and my monitor refresh rate detected correctly. So I don't understand why Windows is not able to do this?

It's not as crazy as it sounds. Refresh rates below 75 Hz, sometimes below 85Hz, on CRT monitors often caused flickering of the display that was not only visible but fatiguing and annoying. This is not the case with LCD monitors which are flicker-free at 60 Hz. Setup starts at 60Hz because that's the recommended setting for LCDs. If they're capable of vertical refresh rates up to 70 or 75, setting them there shouldn't damage them, but there's simply no point in doing so. I think that Vista setup was correct on this one.
>

Why DirectX full screen applications/games run at 60Hz? Why my monitor refresh rate switch from 75Hz to 60Hz when I execute a full screen DirectX application? Why we found the same Windows XP 60Hz bug in Windows Vista?

On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 05:41:01 -0700, BillD wrote:

Why DirectX full screen applications/games run at 60Hz? Why my monitor refresh rate switch from 75Hz to 60Hz when I execute a full screen DirectX application? Why we found the same Windows XP 60Hz bug in Windows Vista?

I can't follow you, Bill. What bug? Please describe the problem you're having with the refresh rate. I'm sitting here with a dual-monitor setup, and both LCD displays are set to 60Hz. I'd never do that with CRT monitors, but LCD monitors give flicker-free, perfect images at 60Hz.

The matter is simple really. Ever since Windows 2000, it has been hard-coded in the OS to default to 60 Hz when it runs a fullscreen Direct3D or OpenGL application. This, to my knowledge, was originally done to prevent potential harm to the monitor. The problems with this "feature" were two fold: 1) It would not revert back to the original setting after the D3D or OpenGL application ended, and 2) The fact that if the display works correctly at the slected refresh rate on the desktop, it will work correctly at the same refresh rate and same resolution in a 3D application. Windows was not intelligent enough to know that because Windows doesn't think. Programmers think, and the ones responsible for this "feature" didn't think enough.
The solutions to this problem range from the down and dirty to the hardware manufacturer-supported. The original fixes were programs that you could run, select the refresh rates you wanted for each resoltution, and the program would edit the Windows Registry and delete every refresh rate entry below the target value for each resolution you specify. That way when Windows would default to the lowest avail setting, it would only see the refresh rate you had specified. The newer approach, and the one I use in XP revolves around the graphics card manufacturer's drivers. Most new drivers have a section in them for setting the refresh rate overrides for your display. Unfortunately the beta drivers from NVIDIA for Vista do not appear to have that setting available.
I, myself, am about to try one fo the older workarounds and see if that works. I'll post here with my results. My problem is actually a bit more complicated. The setting in the control panel is set for 85Hz, but Windows is only running at 75 Hz (confirmed through the monitor's On Screen Display). Changing it back to 60 Hz, then back up to 85 Hz doesn't seem to do anything. I'm hoping this will fix my issue as well
-Paul

"milleron" wrote:

On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 05:41:01 -0700, BillD BillD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
Why DirectX full screen applications/games run at 60Hz? Why my monitor refresh rate switch from 75Hz to 60Hz when I execute a full screen DirectX application? Why we found the same Windows XP 60Hz bug in Windows Vista?
I can't follow you, Bill. What bug? Please describe the problem you're having with the refresh rate. I'm sitting here with a dual-monitor setup, and both LCD displays are set to 60Hz. I'd never do that with CRT monitors, but LCD monitors give flicker-free, perfect images at 60Hz.

This is a great post. Very informative. Thank you for your level of detail!
"DemBones79" wrote in message

The matter is simple really. Ever since Windows 2000, it has been hard-coded in the OS to default to 60 Hz when it runs a fullscreen Direct3D or OpenGL application. This, to my knowledge, was originally done to prevent potential harm to the monitor. The problems with this "feature" were two fold: 1) It would not revert back to the original setting after the D3D or OpenGL application ended, and 2) The fact that if the display works correctly at the slected refresh rate on the desktop, it will work correctly at the same refresh rate and same resolution in a 3D application. Windows was not intelligent enough to know that because Windows doesn't think. Programmers think, and the ones responsible for this "feature" didn't think enough.
The solutions to this problem range from the down and dirty to the hardware manufacturer-supported. The original fixes were programs that you could run, select the refresh rates you wanted for each resoltution, and the program would edit the Windows Registry and delete every refresh rate entry below the target value for each resolution you specify. That way when Windows would default to the lowest avail setting, it would only see the refresh rate you had specified. The newer approach, and the one I use in XP revolves around the graphics card manufacturer's drivers. Most new drivers have a section in them for setting the refresh rate overrides for your display. Unfortunately the beta drivers from NVIDIA for Vista do not appear to have that setting available.
I, myself, am about to try one fo the older workarounds and see if that works. I'll post here with my results. My problem is actually a bit more complicated. The setting in the control panel is set for 85Hz, but Windows is only running at 75 Hz (confirmed through the monitor's On Screen Display). Changing it back to 60 Hz, then back up to 85 Hz doesn't seem to do anything. I'm hoping this will fix my issue as well
-Paul

"milleron" wrote:
On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 05:41:01 -0700, BillD BillD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
Why DirectX full screen applications/games run at 60Hz? Why my monitor refresh rate switch from 75Hz to 60Hz when I execute a full screen DirectX application? Why we found the same Windows XP 60Hz bug in Windows Vista?
I can't follow you, Bill. What bug? Please describe the problem you're having with the refresh rate. I'm sitting here with a dual-monitor setup, and both LCD displays are set to 60Hz. I'd never do that with CRT monitors, but LCD monitors give flicker-free, perfect images at 60Hz.